#you consider hs2 canon

[dave-shit-kat]

One of the many problems with Homestuck is the target audience. I often tell people that I don't think kids younger than 15 should read the comic and I always get crazy looks for that.

Yes, I know the fandom (right now) has many kids. Yes, I've read the comic; I know its themes, contents and how they're presented. And the problems lie on that specifically.

Because Homestuck isn't and never wanted to be a fucking pedagogy example, it takes many liberties with what it narrates and how. While I agree that some themes can be treated in any media, and while I agree that adult jokes can be made in kids' medias, we have to keep in mind that certain things have to be treated properly when talking to younger audiences, and that adult jokes have to be made with a structure that doesn't allow the kid to understand what the joke acutally means (also, you can't base an entire show on adult jokes only, or having them too often, or it won't be an age appropriate show anymore). Basically; people who have in mind a target age STUDY the fucking targeted age; something Homestuck never did.

So the result is a colorful and silly and dumb webcomic, that seems appealing to unsupervised 11 year olds (I've met them in the fandom, I'm not inventing anything), that also have read a comic that talks about racism, sex, rape, pedophilia, incest, totalitarism, and things like that. As I said, you CAN have kids medias that treat those topics, but the situation with Homestuck is much more similar to the situation with Hazbin Hotel; where the media is shown as colorful and silly and funny, more inclined towards edgy kids' type of humor, yet not having kids in mind as the target audience, and so allowing way too many adult topics to be treated in the media itself, while expecting the audience to be mature enough to get it.

As I said and as I repeat myself: yes, Homestuck is dumb, but not for this reason good for kids. And when someone on TikTok dared to tell me "Oh, but these topics and details fly over children's heads" I got mad. HOW does that make it ok!? An adult joke made in 40 episodes of a kid show is one thing; a webcomic with 8k pages FULL of that stuff is another thing. Just because the themes are treated non-seriously, doesn't make stuff like, I don't know, RICK AND MORTY ok for kids.

SUMMARY: Keep kids away from Homestuck.

[davekat-sucks]

that john gender discourse ask make me remember when a friend wanted me to draw a trans guy john drawing for them because it was a headcanon and i got death threats for it because “june is canonically a trans woman”, mind you i knew nothing about homestuck at the time so i was confused and looked up to see if it was true before i could tell the requester about why they made me date a canon trans girl as a trans guy and it wasn’t true at all, the internet just told me from the research that i did was that june was a popular headcanon, so i feel the need to say to the people who think june is canon just because it’s popular is that popular headcanon in a fandom doesn’t = canon or means that it is canon

Seems like those people didn't even try to give a source that June Egbert was supposedly going to be canon because of a Toblerone wish SIX years ago and James Roach claiming it was planned all along in an AMA Dec 2023 (despite that other Toblerone wishes were granted that were near the same year that June wish was first requested). As well as the fact because it will happen in Beyond Canon, which is part of DUBIOUS CANON, it's not really like official canon canon like the base webcomic. Not only that, Andrew Hussie, who was the lead director of the HS2/Beyond Canon project, left the team and it was revealed the sequel was a money laundering scheme. Hussie was in debt to Viz Media so he hired freelance writers and artists and lied to them that they were making something new. People can also say because he's not running the sequel anymore, it can't really be considered as canon or official, even if it was passed down from him to someone else. The man should have stayed with what he started and see it through to the very end. People cling onto this thinking it is canon, when it isn't, even with the tease of a silhouette. It ain't official or real unless it's fully shown in the medium that it claims it will happen. Even then, because of the questionable history and background from Hussie himself and the placement of June's arrival, it's both kind of shitty to make it happen on something that was ran by a shitty person and are only doing it recently for the sake of pandering. It's not like a genuine love to have a trans representation or surprise that the transition was planned all along.

[scalding-homestuck-confessions]

it's simple, if hsbc fans wants to force everyone to accept that John was always meant to be June or that Jade always had a dog dick and was a desperate sexual harasser or that Jane always was a rapist tyrant and use their horrible fanfic sequel as justification, then THEY should concede that Porrim CANONICALLY pale harassed and assaulted Kankri on screen SEVERAL TIMES after being told no (and implied more times off screen too) because Karkat HIMSELF literally said in hs2 that shooshing someone is an 'obscenely public pale act".

MEENAH: u wanna talk about it MEENAH: i know u and jellybulge had a thing KARKAT: FIRST OF ALL--JELLYBULGE? MEENAH: u outlawed fishpuns i gotta make my own fun KARKAT: GROSS. KARKAT: AND I GUESS IF YOU CALL AN OBSCENELY PUBLIC PALE ACT, PERFORMED IN A FUGUE OF DESPERATE PANIC INTENDED TO PREVENT HIM FROM MURDERING ALL OF MY FRIENDS INSTEAD OF JUST HALF OF THEM "A THING". KARKAT: THEN YES, I GUESS WE HAD A THING.

either ALL of hs2/hsbc should be considered as canon fact or not, i'm tired and done with this cherry picking and double standards.

TL;DR, learn to enjoy media while accepting it has major flaws you don't agree with and don't force double standards on people.

[camuyshounen287]

little random but

i like how the adult guardian whatever sprites are a lot more varied in silhouette than the fairly homogenous and templatised kid sprites. gives the feeling that theyve really grown into their own and understood what theyre all about, each having their own defined features. i really like how the style of the comic in general with the abstractions and whatnot translates to the adult sprites. also in beyond canon with the deltritis club. visually, shit aint half bad id say. more (with considering hsbc) beyond the cut

i will not say my actual on god clear opinion on hsbc and hs2 or whatever the semantics are but i am thinking about two different possibilities here

in the beginning where everyone still had a kid style sprite i feel like that could be interpreted as. its sort of a peer sprite more than a kid sprite. and the adult sprites what with being twice the size of the kids and lacking facial features to connect with. it could also serve to bring in the idea that the kids never grew up properly and remain stuck in NOT THEIR HOMES their sburb ages

but there is also the thing that they are just adult sprites. as mentioned prior with deltritis when the new shit happened they updated the sprites so that the characters are now adults.

i dont know how to turn off list pls help anyway uhh this is either the initial group of people making the biznasty deciding they liked the kid sprites better for whatever reason or deciding they didnt want to make a bunch of new adult sprites or this plays into the first bullet point about peer view and growing up and whatever bullshit i was talking about back there.

and it really depends! the peer sprite idea isnt bad i dont think but it depends if they were actually going for that and intended to expand on that concept of the perceptions of the characters affecting the symbolic abstraction render bullshit thats been around for the entirety of homestuck. especially since the aspects are known to be not like material what the world is made of but more mental what the world is made of. the way you see the world. shits grandfathered in already

blah blah shit about whether or not the people making hs2 and hsbc are good writers or not. im not good enough at arguing to care so if youre looking for a fight hop off my lap and get a job this mofo aint santa brah i got no presents for you

[clouds-soup]

My take on Dave's Bro

First of all, I separate Dirk from Dave's Bro. Dirk is an entirely different can of worms that would take me a million for years to explain. If I tried to do both in one post it would turn into a masters level thesis essay that no one wants to read 😭 Second, I have read through Homestuck twice, I've read the epilouges, and I'm currently reading hs2. This is all just my interpretation of it. THIRD OF ALL ⚠️ i kept getting 500 errors, so some of the screenshots are from some kids' blogs analyzing the Dave and dirk scene. But they ARE all canon.

ANYWAY!!!!

I've seen a few people getting upset at fans characterizing Dave's Bro as abusive, and I get it to some extent. I think the physical abuse is up for interpretation - I also agree that the strife they all have with their guardians is comedic, if that's what you're going off of. I don't think there is an intent for them to *actually* injure each other. But with Dave, this ISNT all there is to go off of. If I remember correctly, Dave is the only one who seems actually hurt after the strife. Based on the note, it seems to be a common occurrence. It could be made out to be brotherly roughhousing- except that it *isn't*. Dave says that he convinced himself that all it was for the first 13 years of his life because it was what was normalized for him, but it wasn't normal. Being trained sense birth to be on edge and expect to be attacked out of nowhere, to get into physical alterations with your guardian to 'prepare you' IS NOT NORMAL! It would have been impossible for Dave to feel safe and grow up normally in an environment like that. He talks about how he never felt at peace because he was always scared. He talks about being scared of metal sounds from the swords. He grew up in fear. He did not feel love - Bro did NOT love him.

However, I think that the neglect is undeniable. Neglect is a form of abuse. Either you think it's because bro had malicious intent, or because he just didn't want/know how to take care of a kid, the neglect still happened. I think the most obvious example of this in the comic is when Dave is talking to Dirk, and he mentioned that he didn't even know what a fridge was for - meaning he didn't have extra food at home. He doesn't even get to keep food and water in his house - he hides it in his closet. THAT is more than just negelct. He alludes to other things going on that he doesn't want to drag anyone else into. If you consider Paradox Space canon, he mentions being locked in a dark room alone. Dave was a baby when Dirk found him, so sense birth, he was fending for himself. He had to figure out mundane, domestic tasks like laundry and cooking by himself. If he didn't teach himself how to find food, he would die, it's as simple as that. So not only did he live in fear, but he also had to worry about his survival...Basically sense birth. Or ectobiological creation, I guess.

The relationship Dave has with his Bro is complicated. When grieving their guardians, John is sad, and Rose is angry, but Dave just feels conflicted. I think it's clear that he is still figuring things out at this point, and I think the separation from his Bro allows for him to think about everything that has happened to him. It is confirmed that his upbringing is set apart from the others - the other guardians genuinly cared for and loved their child. Bro did not love Dave. The lack of love can be just as hurtful as the other abuses he was dealing with. He is given the opportunity to explore what has happened to him, and how unfair it was.

Anyway, i guess my point is, that it is insane to claim that people characterizing Dave's Bro as abusive is unfounded. People are the product of their upbringing, and that argument is explored in Homestuck. Dave's character was shaped partly because of his upbringing- it sets him apart from the others and allows for personal development.

[dingodad]

I would think that's a pretty broad definition of success for a work ha ha. I think you could call any work a success if the goal is just to get me to have an opinion on it.

As for whether where it's posted matters from an artistic standpoint? Absolutely! The context a work is placed in can matter immensely. I think if a work wants to work against preconceptions of canonicity, it should abandon the markers of canonicity.* Otherwise to me it's all a bit like a gallery exhibit saying "gallery exhibits are no more special than any other work of art." If you really wanted to explore that, why put it in a gallery? Why not prove it by abandoning the gallery framework altogether?

*And I think we can recognize what these markers are. If you show someone HS2 and some fan-made Homestuck sequel I think they would easily identify which one is associating itself with officiality and authority. The Epilogues are hosted on the Homestuck website. The Beyond Canon credits list out every work it considers "The Homestuck Universe." Let's be honest here, it has a literal official license, it doesn't present itself as a co-equal in the field. This all serves to reify the idea of "canon" or "official" works in contrast to others, instead of breaking down the barriers between them.

I think you could call any work a success if the goal is just to get me to have an opinion on it.

...yes! that's art!

...it's all a bit like a gallery exhibit saying "gallery exhibits are no more special than any other work of art." If you really wanted to explore that, why put it in a gallery? Why not prove it by abandoning the gallery framework altogether?

...no!?! the purpose of an art gallery is not to elevate any one piece as being more special than another😭😭😭😭😭😭 this absolutely speaks more to your own preconceptions about value and authority that i have been asking you to break down this whole conversation than it does to homestuck's own perceived values. if you're unable to examine something you bought at an amateur sale on the same playing field upon which you examine something you see in a gallery that is without question your failing and not the gallery's failing!

[romanceclub-confessionss]

It's not a confession, I had a doubt, since these stories that get a continuation or spin-off are now becoming quite famous, as for the slots part, would the first slot be placed as canon when the continuation of the story began? or what.

sorry for the inconvenience.

the last active slot you played will be the one which will move on to the sequel.

so for eg, you play hs with three slots, say, one for lucifer, one for mimi and one for malbonte. the most recent one you've played is malbonte's so when you begin hs2, the game will consider malbonte to be your final LI and that's how the story will play out in hs2

- mod lucien

[hms-no-fun]

one thing i'm curious about is if you're currently reading / drawing inspiration from any other contemporary HS fanworks. i know KITTYQUEST just dropped its epilogue like less than a week ago, so it's definitely a big era for Homestuck Fanworks That Have Jade Harley Have Kids lmaoooo

i may talk a big game about how you can't hope to substantively discuss what homestuck *is* without also examining its fanworks, but unfortunately i am myself woefully under-read and out of date. i kinda stopped reading homestuck fanworks after 2020 because. well. at the risk of getting into the weeds of fandom drama. all the ones i really liked stopped updating when the fandom environment turned from passively toxic to aggressively poisonous, and there was at least a 50/50 chance that the creator of any given active fanwork was either with or supported the group of people who wielded that poison.

that feeling is far less prominent now but i am still skeptical any time a new homestuck fanwork gets popular. they have to pass a litmus test first: is this person shitty or weird about the epilogues/hs2? they don't have to have liked either work necessarily, they just have to acknowledge that those works exist, have influence, and are worth talking about, even if they personally don't want to do the talking. god this all sounds so petty, but people lost jobs over what happened. i don't think i can have a positive interaction with anyone who is simply unwilling to have an in-depth conversation about the contents of a text without feeling the need to pass objective moral judgments at every turn, nor do i think i will get much out of the fanworks such a person might produce. so i save us all the trouble and don't bother!

that said, i quite like Kittyquest. i'm way behind on it though, as i am on everything. that Kitty showed up not too long after Yiffy actually inspired me to create Edie, because i love the idea of "Jade's Daughter" being this extraordinarily flexible archetype. it feels like kind of a combo-breaker considering how rigid homestuck's archetypes typically are. i also very much admire Kittyquest's commitment to fleshing out the culture and history of Earth C, especially in the ways it seems to deliberately break from what we've seen of it in post-canon. the lack of worldbuilding the epilogues is one of its biggest weaknesses in my opinion, so i always like it when a story tries to pick up that slack. the artstyle being so divorced from homestuck's yet still somehow indebted to it really encouraged me to try different things with the types of images we started putting into godfeels. what i love about post-canon broadly is just how varied it is artistically, stylistically. i think it's good and compelling and healthy that so much art in this space is willing to play with these things in such constructive ways.

the other contemporary fanwork that really has influence on godfeels is Vast Error. which i am also behind on. but Snowbound Blood is a personal favorite whose tone (at its best) matches the vibes i'm going for in 3.2. the biggest i guess Thing for me wrt Vast Error is how different its universe engine session is from what we saw in homestuck. its logic, its mechanics, its purpose-- the whole thing is so alien, and yet it has Prospit and Derse, it has Spades Slick and other such guys, it has Skaia, so there's clear continuity. if we imagine the universe engine as a procedurally generated video game, these commonalities suggest that there are stable constants in the formula. it was that alongside all the other wildly different fansessions on MSPFA that started the gears turning which would eventually lead to the EWL. the idea of an organization of castoffs from the infinite fanontinuum of alternate sessions, who study the constants and variables across countless UE instances and build squads of sailors who specialize in particular behavioral clusters. oh this session has an overpowered Jack making it unviable? send in the Jills, they'll show him what's what.

i guess if there's a thread here it's that i'm most inspired by what metatextual trends suggest about the hypothetical Ultimate Self of any given homestuck narrative convention. i'm not saying that's a good thing but i guess it has worked out okay so far.

i could shout out other fanworks that i haven't read but i think i would rather hear from y'all. what's out there right now? what's good? i should probably catch up

[v-t-holmes-arts]

putting this on this blog first so it has more chance it reaches the target audience

i went out of my way to research the claim that james roach is the evil mastermind behind homestuck post-canon after having had seen that take at the begining of the year

tl;dr: no, it was hussie's idea

(if you're not convinced, more info under the cut)

i should preface this by saying i have no strong opinion on the post-canon hs, other than i think epilogues are a bit of a slog to get through due to the fact they lost a bit of their charm by being solely text-based

homestuck epilogues and hsbc are, while you don't have to consider them canon (a source further down the line calls hs2 an "official fanonization"), nevertheless supported by hussie, as per this interview he did with austinado of vast error fame, and sees them as a good way to open up new opportunities

also, while hussie's involvment with hsbc and other current hs projects is minimal now, he's still there to consult them if needed (as per the about page on the beyond canon website)

epilogues were not james roach's idea either, see this edit from andrew hussie's newspost from 4/13/16

in fact, roach was not even involved with the epilogues (retrieved from the unofficial collection bc the actual site is shitting itself as i write this)

this archived faq from the homestuck 2 website from 2019 very explicitly states that what is now known as hsbc has been conceived by hussie

so explicit in fact that it's stated several times

i could probably go research the games too, but i don't think they're as relevant or controversial as the above

i don't really know how to conclude this, it's all pretty self-evident and clear information to me

[lazy-dog24601]

Hussie is such a coward for pulling a "death of the author" and then going on to give his blessing to the HS2 team.

Like thanks for nothing, dick. You write about how the author has no real authority over their own creation and then go on to endorse an entire fucking team that FUCKING CLAIMS TO INHERIT HOMESTUCK.

"ermmm we the official homestuck team don't like it when fans consider the (official) sequel to homestuck non-canon because we have the blessing of the author!!1!" motherfucker Andrew Hussie fucking died, Lord English capped his ass. Hussie lost his fucking authority.

[davekat-sucks]

idk why some people think that like, everyone who interacts with you considers what you say as gods word or something.

like im a fan of your blog quite a lot, but it doesnt mean i agree with everything! there is plenty of stuff i disagree with, but there is also stuff i do agree with.

what ive always liked about the blog is the openness to any opinion. im assuming there have been plenty of times you post a anon ask you dont really agree with, but you still put it out there! i feel like that says alot, that you arent necessarily just a echo chamber type space.

alot of us are also queer folks too who care about those rights and everything, but we just have more nuanced views on these things. other anons have talked about that here too.

im a nonbinary gay autistic and sometimes i do not like the writing decisions people make! just because it is considered "gay" or something doesnt mean i have to like it? im allowed to think things are written badly and arent good representation.

me not liking june egbert isnt some "terf rhetoric". its literally because my autistic ass likes having quality writing. i like transgender stories when they make sense to me, and june's story feels like a joke.

ANYWAY i hope i make sense i know i rambled alot. i like davekat-sucks alot and i feel like the community here is alot more open to different opinions than other spaces, thats why i like it.

Great words spoke, Anon.

Yeah, I don't mind people who disagree. All I do is try to show proof or evidence to backup my claim to whatever opinion I have. I don't work with Andrew Hussie or James Roach. Any theories of why certain things happened are just that unless stated from the people themselves. Doesn't stop me from making jabs and jokes if certain parts of what they're doing with Homestuck or Hiveswap series goes wrong. Deltarune gets chapter 3 before Hiveswap gets Act 3. That's just sad. There are times that I disagree, yeah. I do try my best to look on the other side and what they are saying. If there is proof or evidence, it shows it has weight that isn't just hearsay. There have been cases about certain fans that are part of the LGBT group that aren't fan of either how HS2/Beyond Canon is handling the narrative, characters, certain pairings, and of course, June Egbert. Same Homestuck fans would throw a fit at them, accusing them if they are really LGBT or just faking it. Because apparently, everyone in the LGBT has to like the same thing when they are just normal people that have their own thought and opinions on how art is either good or bad, regardless if it caters to them or not. Same has applied to race if a POC fan disagrees with fanon interpretations on the cast. It's not just Homestuck fandom either, it's any fanbase. They can't speak out if they are accused of being bigots or fakers. I just wanna be the few that speak out the series that I once loved. On how it could have been something great. I turn Anonymous on to be fair for both sides, those that hate me and those that want to vent out something they couldn't on their personal account. It's understandable nobody wants to expose themselves. It's why we go on the Internet, because most of us can just lie and play Anonymous.

[gardengnosticator]

you know what, considering hs2's only open canonical transfem is homewrecking, neglectful mother, dog dick jade i'm sure june egbert will be a positive breath of fresh air solely because you have to be under the earth's mantle not to clear that bar.

[dynamistimaeus]

This post is about to get long, so I added a ‘read more’. I was working on this back in December of last year (2022). Though, I am now sharing my thoughts and ‘theories’ as the HS2 writing team has changed and the story will go a slightly different direction.

I want to compile my thoughts involving the Homestuck Epilogues and Homestuck^2. Not necessarily just my opinions of it, but some things I noticed. More of an in-depth analysis, along with some of my own commentary and several ‘theories’.

There was originally a post that sparked this interest; however, I no longer have it and I don’t want this to become a debate. The person was voicing their opinion and that is totally fair and fine! They are in the right to do that. My thoughts on it still remain, though, as it got me thinking and theorizing more deeply. Something akin to igniting the fire, so to speak. While I don’t think opinions on fictional media are right or wrong, they are still just that, opinions. This being said, I feel like sometimes fandom runs with opinions and considers it factual (or canon) when in reality it really isn’t. At the end of the day, an opinion of something, and even theories, are still just those things. The important thing is that it is actually a good thing that someone can formulate their own opinions about media, and art, in general. Art is subjective and even if there is a very specific message to something, at the end of the day, if it can evoke something in you and make you think deeper.. Then, that is impressive and honestly really normal. It should draw some emotion from you, hence why it is subjective. You look at it from your own lens and determine what it means to you, using your own personal truths. Now, onto the fun part.

While I was thinking about what this individual said, it made me reconsider certain story elements. They had made a comment that Rose would have been a more interesting villain, and that is fair; however, technically, if you consider Ult Dirk a villain, then Rose would be too. Sometimes I think people forget that Dirk and Rose are similar (like how Roxy and Dave are), and this also goes into Jake and Jade being similar and the qualities that both Jane and John/June share too. For the record, I don’t necessarily consider Ult Dirk a villain, and it is definitely fine if you do; however, this goes a little into my theories surrounding things. In all regards, I think the fictional version of Ult would be more of a morally grey character, possibly someone that would fit better in an ‘anti-hero’ sort of role, since he clearly believes what he is doing is the ‘right’ thing to do. Furthermore, I believe his character always had the possibility of becoming this way and not necessarily ‘becoming what he hates,’ but someone that can control things and ‘fix’ things. We see a lot in the comic that Dirk pushes his friends in odd ways to show he cares. By extension, Bro Strider also tries to do these things— and, a side note here.. I saw someone make a theory about Bro trying to turn Dave into a Dirk splinter.. But the canonical points of Homestuck disprove that theory.. In that Dave doesn’t have a heart shirt as a kid because Bro is a Prince of Heart.. He has a heart shirt, because John has a spades shirt.. So on and so forth. It is just a nod back to the card suites, as well as the trolls quadrants. Along with this, Bro Strider— as a Dirk adjacent being, would be doing what he ‘thinks’ is best. We even see Dirk mirror this kind of behavior with his creation of Brobot to ‘strife’ with Jake to ‘prepare and train’ him better. In Dirk’s mind, he was doing what was ‘best’ or ‘correct’. And, even if it is bad what he was doing.. It is oddly his way of showing he cares. Furthermore, Bro Strider, with the knowledge from Lil Cal (and those inhabiting him) definitely tries to create the scratch or attempts to ‘delay’ or ‘end’ the game however he can.. We see him battle Jack. Bro Strider was technically one of the only Beta Guardians that actively tries to interfere with the game, while Grandpa Harley seems to have his own agenda and hand in things— we learn more about this when it comes to Hiveswap. Grandpa Harley has some very deeply rooted ties with the cherubs and their magic, as well as many other links back to the game.. But this post isn’t about that, so I will save that for a different time.

Back to looking at Rose’s character for a moment. I want to make it clear that Rose has always had the ability to dig deeper into the narrative and the game as a whole. Her seer powers allow that. The original post I mentioned, also explained this well. They made the comments about Alpha Mom. While the guardians are really interesting and helpful to give us insight on the kids.. I also want to reiterate the kids aren’t the guardians. And, in my mind, I am of the impression that they may share the aspect with their alternate timeline self, but not the class.. I made this theory from looking at the trolls: The dancestors and decendants— they all share the same aspect, but not the same class. With this information, I started to dig a bit deeper.. Which brings me to some other interesting finds.

Some of the kids share some aspects with the trolls, and even with the cherubs. Now, before I get more into that, I want to brush up on my theories involving HS^2 and the turns some of the characters took.. First, starting with Dirk. It has been a bit since I read the story of Timaeus, but I already have a few correlating ties back to it and the turn Dirk’s character takes. Within the story of Timaeus, as Plato writes it.. Eventually, the character of Timaeus begins to take over the narrative completely. The full story never was finished, as Plato died prior to finishing the dialogues, but I think this is important.. It plays back into a few other things involving Dirk’s character too, but I don’t want to stay on this, as I have a lot of other thoughts to unpack. Now, another interesting thing about Dirk, and more specifically Bro Strider, is the ties they have with Kamina from Gurren Lagaan. Unsure of how many of you have seen the anime, but Kamina— one of the main characters, goes by the nickname of ‘Bro’, especially to the younger character Simon. Now, some of the methods Kamina uses to ‘help Simon’ basically.. Deal with the destroyed version of the world, aren’t ideal.. But a lot of the things Kamina does in that show are very identical to things Dirk, and Bro Strider, do in regards to the game.. And, well, end of the world, essentially. Along with this, Roxy (and adjacently) Mom Lalonde share a lot of qualities with Yoko from that show.. From the scarf to the amazing rifle action. Also, the weirdly overly fetishization of female characters that happened in the 90’s.. It was bad, and it even shows with Roxy a bit.. Her personality is also a little similar to Yoko’s.. Though, the other interesting thing about this is that Jake shares some qualities of her too.. The shorts, the guns, the infamous kissing in front of a volcano.. You know, among other things.. But I think Jake having more ties back to Indiana Jones and Laura Croft make a bit more sense.. Considering Grandpa Harley.. And, the fact Hussie has started they weren’t really sure what to do with Jake’s character for a while— sidenote: I love Jake and want to see him fully use his Hope powers.. But I’ll brush up on this a little more as I unpack some things..

I think the Epilogues and Homesuck^2 are.. Kind of replaying the events of things that happened with the trolls’ ancestors.. To the way Jane is becoming Condy.. Even her ties to Gamzee. It makes me think of the relationship between Condy and GHB.. Even the fact Jane, a human, is with a troll to the side, but is fine with destroying the rest. Condy was with a human because ‘he made her laugh,’ but was fine with destroying anyone else. With this, we even see in one timeline (the Candy one) that Karkat becomes a lot like the Signless, which makes sense, especially if Jane is filling the role of Condy. There isn’t a kid that shares the Rage aspect as Gamzee, so I wondered if this was why they ‘brought him back’.. But that doesn’t explain Vriska, because Rose technically shares a classpect with her and still is alive within both timelines.. Though, interestingly enough, Terezi’s relationship with Rosebot in the Meat timeline mirrors her past relationship with Vriska, as well as that of Redglare and Mindfang.. Now, this is the interesting thing.. Jake would then technically be in the same shoes as Cronus and Eridan if it was following this trend, but he isn’t. He’s an outlier.. Though, on the other hand, John/June being a breath player.. I think that is why they will ultimately still ‘be the hero’ in all of this. Having ties back to Tavros’ ancestor, and what that entails involving the Signless. We also only see John/June in the candy timeline, as it is believed they died within the meat one.. Upon being sent back.. Now, even more interestingly.. Dave shares an aspect with Aradia and her ancestor and dancestor.. Which we see Davebot currently traveling along with Aradia.. But he also shares an aspect with Caliborn, being the same ‘color’ of the cherub swirls.. Also, think of the parallels here of Lord English and The Handmaid… Which also brings me to the fact that Jade and Calliope also share an aspect (as well as Kanaya; however, she never goes Godtier).. And, the color scheme of Jade fits closely with Calliope.. In the Meat timeline, they have merged together— to an extent.. Which makes me wonder if Davebot and that Jade will eventually have to fight one another? Would Davebot win or would that version of Calliope be the actual winner? Since, as we know, Calliope was the one who was supposed to win between the two cherubs, which was the reason the session was doomed.. As Caliborn takes over entirely (becoming Lord English). I also would like to point out that Aradia accidentally left Sollux behind somewhere… Will he eventually become a power source for Jane? Just some random thoughts. I’m still digging into things.. But I do think some of the characters going the routes they do make sense more in this context.

Last notes, I also believe the reason Roxy (within the Meat timeline) is fine with executing Ult Dirk. When they talk to Dave about it, he seems uncomfortable about it (reasonably so), but Roxy doesn’t.. They also share an aspect with Equius (and we all know about his ancestor)…

Anyways, this is all of my findings for now. I’ll continue updating as I find more things to discuss (and have the energy to do so).

[beangods]

14, 16, 18 and 20 for the homestuck questions.

14. Least favorite character?

eridan.

16. NOTP?

vriska x men. also dont like vriska x characters who are canonically men. stop fanoning your way into femslash when homestuck has a million billion compelling and bonkers canonically girl characters to smush together. ALSO rose or kanaya x men/canonical men come on now people we've been over this. if you want One Specific Ship i hate for no real reason though i dont really have one OH WAIT gamtav. tell me you dont actually give a shit about tavros without saying those words in that order. he was NOT reciprocating those advances leave him alone!!

18. Do you want Homestuck to just die already?

i wish the main comic had been wrapped up in a satisfactory conclusive way and that hs2/the epilogues either never existed or were likewise satisfactory and conclusive OR AT LEAST kept canon with the snapchat upd8s. i want them to bring back paradox space (official non-canon comics) and keep making merch forever and also for everyone with headcanons i personally dislike to leave the fandom and get really into something else instead.

20. Tell us how Homestuck has affected you in real life.

oh god. genuinely, homestuck completely shaped my adolescence and pop culture diet in extremely noticeable ways. i was one of those dave transmascs

i cosplayed vriska to school. i only really hit it off with my last ex when we started talking about homestuck. on 4/13 last year i almost passed up going to the club because i hadn't drawn any fan art yet. in fact part of why my sleep schedule is so fucked up is that for years i would stay up til 1-3am drawing homestuck fan art. indeed, the fact that i run two homestuck blogs impacts my schedule and daily routine significantly. i've given graded presentations on homestuck music in university. i still say "now we're cooking with petrol!" in real life. not only did i have moirails and auspistices and blackrom crushes in real life in middle school, i also, currently, as an adult, have someone in my life i consider my moirail. over half of my prosthetics, which i use in real sexual encounters, are tentacles, and You Know Why. my OC-verse has been radically shaped by homestuck (and the energy i spend on homestuck does NOT go to my OC-verse; before getting into the comic i thought i'd be a bestselling author by now). there is not a single area of my life that has not been touched by this webcomic. i will probably be buried with a scalemate plushie.

[friedchickenusa]

Do you consider the epilogues non canon like most people

dunno. theyre one image into the post-endgame, one of several. i havent read any mspfas that explore the post-endgame YET but i have them written down (stuff like homeslice, burning down the house, act 7, acr omega i believe all explore the same narrative zone as the epilogues)

so for now, the epilogues and hs2 are my only reference point for "what happens after". but i dont think it matters whether or not its "canon". its all fiction anyway.

what makes the epilogues and hs2 unique among all explorations into the post-endgame is that the original author(s) stand behind them. they created it. and as such, it can be considered "official".

so, i guess i DONT consider it canon. but i do consider it official, and as such, its "closer" to the original homestuck than any fanfic. more closely linked. hope that helps.

i rejected it at first, but the idea that the epilogues and hs2 put forth, the idea that i can make anything i want canon using my imagination, is pretty powerful, and funny because it basically inspires fan/foe fiction with no necessity to stick to the facts as presented by even homestuck1. you can just make anything up and write it. so lets go

[hellstobetsy]

Homestuck Acts 1-4: Like watching an Actual Play podcast. It was fun at the time, and there's still stuff to like, but rereading it now there's a loooooot of fucking around, especially in act 1. Stuff like Dave spending 100+ pages collecting items for a boss fight and the joke is that he gets one-shot and never uses any of them.

Homestuck Intermission: A commonly asked question by new fans is "Can I skip the intermission?". It's pretty much entirely time-based puzzles, but does have one of HS's best lines.

Homestuck Act 5: Turns into a tighter-paced sci-fi action comic. Trolls become very prominent, Vriska is introduced and becomes nearly the protagonist. Generally considered the "good" part and the peak of its popularity. If you're Homestuck curious but not 8000 pages Homestuck curious, it actually might be worth reading Act 5 Act 1 just by itself, as it's pretty short and condensed and heavily features Vriska at her Vriskest. You'd get the gist of it from that.

Homestuck Acts 6-7: This was supposed to be like three months long and instead they stretched it out for years and you can really tell. Self-defensively meta ("Real people don't have character arcs") and has aged the worst. [S] Collide is still hype though.

Epilogues/Homestuck 2: Somewhere between a blatant cash grab to solve Hussie's money troubles and a nervous breakdown, introducing completely insane plot points and character twists at a rapid beat. It's so bad and stupid that it nearly loops back around to being ironically good. Most of the art budget went to Viz Media. Names a major non-joke character "Yiffany Longstocking". Canceled mid-story.

Homestuck Beyond Canon (Currently updating!): A revival of Homestuck 2 run by the Steven Universe music team (?!) who got the IP rights in exchange for promising to finish HS2. The writing is much improved but it's built on a truly batshit foundation. Tries and mostly succeeds in making Yiffany Longstocking a cool badass punk. They're currently working on Homestuck's first big music video in years and the fandom might pop off when that comes out in a few weeks.

tl;dr: Maybe just read Act 5 Act 1, which can be banged out pretty quick and has the tightest writing in the whole comic.

It kinda sounds like Homestuck is the opposite of Steven Universe, in that Homestuck was really good at the time cause the fandom was active and you got regular updates, but it's not as good now cause it's way too long, the writing is mid in hindsight, and there's a bunch of stuff that didn't age well, meanwhile Steven Universe was MISERABLE to be a fan of as it was airing because the fandom was a torrential nightmare and the release schedule was incredibly inconsistent, but now that the dust has settled and you can just watch the entire show at your leisure it's obvious it's still a really good show.